Over the last few weeks Thomas Cook/Going places are suposed to have the same discount towers as Co-ops. The sale is up to 10%, A mix of both on screen and commision discount. But TC agents have been giving 10% of their commision, which then leaves 4% store profit. Is it me or are they just pushing co-ops out? As we all know if coop tries to beat this it will leave them with no profit.
We are in a town with a coop, going places and cooks. Were all fighting for what we can get but that is a joke now.
Any opinions on this?
I hardly think anyone is pushing anyone else out. I think you will find its a cut throat industry out there, and Im sure Thomas Cook, Co-op and Going Places are all rooting for business.
It seems to me, Its always the big boys that come under fire during this and any other time of year in fact. Maybe if all agents had the passion and determination that the big boys like Thomas Cook staff have, people wouldnt have as much room for winging and moaning.
What profit or revenue is earned is down to the sales consultant in question, and at the end of the day, 4% is better than nothing. I dont feel Thomas Cook, Going Places or the co-op staff are deliberately under cutting, they are simply gunning for the business. Perhaps others should take a leaf out of their books, and have the drive they have and stop moaning.
Yes, im sure they all have discount campaigns, and yes im sure there are higher discounts going through, but thats their choice, and doesnt warrant being labled a "Joke".
Deal with it and move on.
comeflywithme - before you start labelling companies and their actions jokes, try and get your facts correct. The reason TCooks is giving 10percent off their holidays is because its a GUARANTEED 10% off, not upto 10% as you incorrectly stated. All advertisement states GUARANTEED 10% off. If they did not do then it would have serious repercussions from a legal view.
Until the merger goes through Tcook/GPlaces and Co-op are seperate business each vying for each customer's business. In this day and age 4% profit is far better and zero % profit.
I can only imagine that you are bitter about losing business but unfortunately that the way things are.
comeflywithme - The other two are talking as all big companies do, they don't care who gets in their way; it is about growth.
When they eventually loose their jobs as many will over the next few years as more companies join together they will probably then understand your plight.
Good luck in the future.
I have created many websites, including for cheap cruises, cruise deals and a new one attacking cruise holidays.
Cruisegle - If a company does try to grow then its pretty useless trading as eventually you will fold. Its a very poor business accumen if you do not intend to grow your business
As for job loss I will cross that bridge when I come to it, which I cant foresee been soon.
jorda525 I think you read into my post what you wanted to read; read it again and show me where I said it was OK not to grow your business?
Plus, a company making £1m a year profit will not fold if it does not grow, especially if the outgoings are very low.
Do you happen to work for a Bank?
I accept that you did not state it was not ok to grow your business but even companies as big as TC and Tui must continue to grow even at the size of their companies to succeed.
It only takes 1 incident to lose a substantial amount of profit, take the recent Tui £117,000,000 blackhole discovered, Thats why businesses must continue to irrespective of their size.
No, I dont work in a bank, I work in the travel industry, What made you think I worked in a bank?
Jorda525 you clearly dont know how discounts for this promotion work. It is 5% given system generated and a further percentage given by the shop or web to make the 10%. So i suggest you get your facts right before slagging me off.
The point im making is rather than giving the extra 5% or so to make up the 10% they are giving 10% again. So the customer is getting more than 10% really! Get me? This is a stupid thing to do and wll take the GP and TC shops into a loss also as there is noway you could run a shop that creates around 4% commision. Its basic knowledge with rent. Go back and sit in your box...
Look,
I hardly think its necessary to start a war over who discounts what etc. If a company has to give 10%, irrespective of on screen or whatever, its because they have to to get the booking.
Remember, I doubt 10% is given to every booking, and so a "blanket statement" profit of 4% is a load of rubbish. Talk sense.
Yet again, Thomas Cook & Tui are the ones who are slated, and blamed for puching out/under cutting etc etc etc (Boring). Lets just make one thing clear. Its unlikely that a company is going to be beaten on its own holidays by a 3rd party. Surely thats not a recent issue is it? It seems smaller companies spit their dummys out just because a bigger operator offers better prices on their own holidays!!
I'll be honest, I work for one of the big boys, and we sell on SERVICE, not just price. I have many bookings that have booked because of the service they have recevied, not everyone is price driven!! I will discount where necessary to get the booking - We dont just offer it for the sake of it, Do you seriously think we go straight in at 10%?? I think not.
I will beat any high street agent on my own in house holidays, or give them it FREE - can you offer that? I doubt it.
I'll say it again, deal with it and move on. And if you dont like what the big boys are doing, perhaps you should join them, then see how your opinions change when you see the service that we are trained to give!!
The thing I find amazing is whenever someone adds to this forum you get people join just to post a comment criticising it. Yet they hide behind a wall of secrecy not telling people who they are. They then disappear.
As too companies undercutting agents for their own products, well that is one of the biggest mistakes you could make to be honest. Unless you ARE trying to push out other shops.
Instead of killing off independents they should be working with them; after all with indepndents on your side you can sell your products to more people without the expense of having to have shops in every town.
comeflywithme - I think you will find that what you have experienced is the exception and not the rule, I find it hard to believe that every booking is made over the 10 percent like you are implying, I think you will find your far off the mark. If this was the case the TCook group would have to answer alot of questions to its shareholders.
As part of the campaign which sounds like you know everything about, you will also see that if TCook does not beat the best competitor price on its own product it has to give it for free. As a matter of interest do you happen to work for Co-op or independant?
Having worked for both 'big boy' and independant agencies, I can see both points of view here. At the end of the day, multiples will always be able to give a larger percentage discount off their inhouse products. That is the way business works in any sector, not just travel. The flip side is that multiples are limited in the operators they offer and can, therefore sometimes be pushed out by independants, who can sell a much broader portfolio and have more price variety.
It IS a cut throat business but what isn't in these times of recession and austerity? We are ALL fighting for the business. I agree with the point already made here-every agent I have worked for, no matter what the size, has trained me to believe that people buy people. The standard of service you provide will normally outweigh any discounts you can offer. Yes, there are occassions I have lost out to a multiple because of the size of discount on offer, but there are also times I have gained from a multiple as a result of the service given or the limited portfolio on offer.
Ultimately, we are all in this together. The future of the travel industry is uncertain at times but we can all learn from each other. Now is not the time for arguing, each side has advantages over the other, all we can do is learn from these!
I agree Emmy. Some people seem to have taken this to heart. I can say I have worked for many various parts in the travel sector and am not against the big boys. I admire them as they were small once remember... I enjoy working for and with them and will continue to do so.
My point was more that. a. they will completely drive out indies and multis and b. they will undercut themselves. The 10% is a big thing for retail to take. Thinking that the store profit goes towards rent and staffing. So making a few % will actually damage the shop.
I agree with price beating. I will always do this and see a small sale better than no sale. But to jump straight in with the small sale is pretty rubbish... And this is done a lot. I have seen it from other cooks and gp branches. Not a good sign for the company.
Just my opinions and obviously some people just want a b*tch fight.
What I find silly is 3 brands from the same company undercutting each other as is what is happening here... So basically all that happens is Co-op gives one price ... GP beats it... then TC beats it.. all the same company ..... all the same product... just money down the drain. You see the samething with Thomson/ 1st Choice shops.
Welcome to the world of the Independent Travel Agent, we have had this argument for years now the likes of TC and co discounting holidays to the same amount as our commission, Virgin are the worst for discounting their own holidays.
Cruise is just as bad, the big Cruise clubs selling cruise's for 0% commission and hoping to reach the target set by the cruise company for a Kick Back when they have reached the set target, CO-OP did the same last year with Ocean Village and with Cosmos.
Its about time the wholesale Discounting Stopped, so we all can earn a living.
End of Rant
Nick - TC and GP are one company Co-op are a completely different company, so fighting for business is hardly silly.
If TC shops and GP are undercutting each other that is silly but Co-op are a rival business at the moment.
Comeflywithme - You make it sound like every booking is done with the large discounts which I can assure is not the case.
Been aggressive on discounts for 6 weeks is only a fraction of the year and it is the rest of year when TCook operates very strict discounting. Usually trying to keep discounting within 5 - 6%.
jorda525 my comment was it is standard that you see differant retail brands e.g. Thomson/First Choice or Going Places/Thomas Cook beating each others prices....which is why I said it is silly. Speaking to other agents this seems to happen around the country
Nick your post stated "What I find silly is 3 brands from the same company undercutting each other as is what is happening here... So basically all that happens is Co-op gives one price ... GP beats it... then TC beats it.. all the same company "
This is 2 different companies, I can understand the sillyness of TC undercutting GP (same company) but to undercut Co-op (seperate company) is not silly.
I do find it silly that different brands undercut each other, but im sure that as many people will say, some customers will tell you that they have had a quote and give you the price but will not state from which company.
Jorda525, your right I did say 3 brands (which they will unless the gov blocks it) and when they are 3 brands (which is how they are acting currently, with co-op pushing TC) they will still end up undercutting each other for that type of customer. The fact the agent does not ask where the quote came from (something I was taught to do working for a multiple) shows more often than not they are dealing with a "in house" quote. At the end of the day as a independent I could not careless as it means the shops doing this will lose money and head office will close them. As to saying it is silly I agree and it happens 52 weeks of the year as any Independent could tell you.
Having asked around I found everyone says by asking the simple question "who gave that quote" you are able to find out what they have been offered.
I personally won't get in to price wars with other agents on our high street. If clients come in to see me with a price I will match the price but I won't beat it. Usually I can win them over through my service levels, as an ex holiday rep I have more insight into European destinations than Joe Bloggs down the road. I know which hotels are good, which are not so good and can confidently make recommendations based on their needs. I all too frequently hear from my clients "I went to XXXXX agency and they were just picking hotels or resorts that are blatantly not suited to us!" I had one in the other day who had a budget went to another agent who straight away knew it wouldn't come in their budget so tried to sell another resort, whereas I concentrated on their chosen areas and highlighted the benefits of their holiday and got them to book, even though it was 50% over their budget. In this day and age people are looking for the best bargain but if you had the choice of booking with an agent who didn't listen to you and understand your needs or an agent who had took the time to get to know you and your needs built a good rapport with them but were a few pounds more expensive, I know who I would be going with. I pride myself on my service and factor this in when I talk to my clients by highlighting what they get when they book with me. They get my direct line number, my email address, they can contact me anytime if they have any questions or queries. If something goes wrong I will deal with it rather than them going to the companies directly and being on hold for hours. I use the ash crisis, snow disruptions, flooding as examples and give them the peace of mind of knowing they have a travel professional there to sort it out should it go wrong.